Queer Elders

The conversation between three older queer people when they feel visible or invisible, when they feel misrepresented, we talk about transphobia Today and its daily impact on trans people, and how society has gotten worse over the last 15 years.

Ellie: I'm 55, and it was 12 years before that, when I first went to see my doctor, and I think up till about 15 years ago, sort of gone through life, just figuring out, you know, and sort of existed, but over the last 15 years, probably I don't understand something's changed. And I don't know if it's just the attitude towards trans people especially, seems to be it seems to be more vicious now than what it was, you know, back in the 90s. Now, I mean, yeah, you got abuse from from blokes, mainly, you know, you might get punched and stuff like that. But nowadays, there is so much more. So not just aggression, but coming from mainstream media and stuff like that. And I don't understand why this has happened.

What's driving it, I mean, it's, it seems like rehashed arguments that were around in the 80s, in the 90s, towards the, you know, then the gay, the gay groups of people, you know, the same sort of things about toilets, and paedophilia and grooming and all that. And so, as I've got older, I am confused, because it's, you know, I felt quite comfortable myself in existence. You know, I never had a problem using bathrooms, things like that. But now, I suddenly feel like there's a target on my back. And if I'm being scrutinised, whether I am or not, it feels like it you know, you've got to be particularly more on your guard now, then what, what I used to be, and I'm not quite sure why that would be, you know, I mean, I'd say I, I've never had too many issues myself going through life and that. But um, yeah, it's just, I just find it a bit odd. And if anyone knows what's going on, if they could tell me, that'd be great.

I’ve had discussions with people online before and I, and what I've said is that, at some point, they're going to come for you as well. You know, you're just, you're just a vehicle, and I'll stand shoulder to shoulder with you, regardless of what you think of me. You know, because this is about the patriarchy sort of, you know, edging their way in and trying to control all of us. And I just think that everyone should have equal rights, but it just like say, it just seems like it's got so much more toxic. And I don't know if it's because of the way people communicate now with social media, and that, you know, whereas before, it'd be like, you know, the National Front and shoving letters through people's doors and things like that. Whereas nowadays, you can get your stuff out there and, and, and everyone can see it instantly around the world. I feel more… uncomfortable about interacting with people now than what I did when I was younger. Yeah, just seems a bit bonkers to me. That's the only way I could describe it. Yeah, in the nicest possible way.

Richard: Well, I didn't know but misunderstood, but I suppose ever since I was a child, I've always felt other as if somehow I was destined for another planet. So I never felt quite at home anywhere. And that's, that's a feeling that's more or less to do with me throughout my life. But I think my, my sort of sexual sort of inclinations have played quite a small part in that I think, quite frankly, it's just part of me. Do you know what I mean?

Because I think there's there is an idea that somehow that gay men are interested in any man that walks down the street. In fact, very few men interest me it sexually, very few men interest me. But it's more about… the problems for me, in old age or throughout my life has been standing still. Because I have always I'm part of the bedsit generation in London where you could get a room in Notting Hill or Bayswater for £4.50 a week. And so we all had a suitcase under the bed. But I've always had a metaphorical suitcase under the bed, so that I'm ready to move and change my environment at the drop of a hat.

And I've done that and moved around. So much so that in old age, it's very, very difficult for me to stand still and find a place… a home if you like, home, which is, which is a feeling really isn't it, it's something within yourself rather than the physical home. I mean, the physical home is important. But you know, I don't mean, to have that sense of being sort of secure and rooted is important, I think, especially as you get older because you have other vulnerabilities.

Irian: Coming out as bi in the 80s, I got attacked from both sides by like gay people and straight people. And, well, I came out as trans and non binary at the beginning of 2010. But for me, the it felt like the first half of the 2010s was actually quite a, there was quite a positive move towards acceptance of trans people. And there was like positive media and I forgot what that I can't remember what that show was called on Channel Four, that's like my own My Transsexual Summer and stuff like that. The thing that turned the corner, from what I could see was Brexit. Because as soon as that happened, it enabled all the not just the transphobia and homophobia and xenophobia, racism and ableism. And all this stuff, boiled up to the surface and actually it never really went away. 

One of our most recent comings out is being someone with DID (Dissociative Identity Disorder), who's a system and therefore, plural, which is why we're using we pronouns instead of only pronouns. The other thing we talked about before, we’d like to talk about, again, is how important it's been, for me to be very visible as all the things I am. An older person, who is, you know, Agender, and Asexual and Trans and all the rest of it. Particularly because so many younger people get dismissed by older people who are transphobic, and all the rest of it. Like, it's just a young people's thing. And we feel like it's really important to be visible to younger people, as an example of like, no, no people of all ages are this. 

Also, because maybe partly because we're a system and there's a lot of different ages in here, which find that we connect with people of all kinds of ages. And it's kind of It feels very important to us to be able to affirm younger people because so many, particularly like, one of the experiences we had on that, trans forum we were in for three years is just realising how many of these young people who are completely starved of any kind of affirmation or encouragement in their families or where they live because they're different. And that just being able to you know, tell people you like them and you encourage them and it's like watering dry plants. And it feels like a very honourable thing to be able to do for people so in a way be like a kind of surrogate parent.  Yeah, so here we are. 60 year old body with like, so far 28 People in here, not all human. Over a dozen comings' out and wondering what's going to be next.

Chloe: You've been listening to Ellie Morgan, Richard Carter, and Irian Greenleaf with Chloe Meineck facilitating. This is a call for younger queers to think about how we include older queer people in our events, workshops and our communities.